Now that I'm stuck with COBRA for a while, I figured I might as well use my benefits for the yuckiness women must endure. My gynecologist has been my doctor since I was a teenager. He (as one of the only people I knew who had gone to college) encouraged me to go to college.
He didn't tell me what I wanted to hear.
He said that I need to think about having a baby soon, in the next couple years. He said it gets a lot harder and more complicated if I wait longer. I'm 27 now.
I guess I was hoping he would say that I have 5 years, no big deal, women do it all the time! In fact, I didn't even ask him at all because that is what I have been convincing myself. So-and-so and such-and-such did it, so can I. Reality for us high-achieving women is that it's ticking. I don't have 5 years.
No one with that much experience had ever said it out loud. I was in shock. I think I muttered something about adoption. But, he's right. I can't just put it off forever. I've even been thinking adoption for a long time, and it still smacked me upside the head. My hands were shaking.
I just cried when I got home. My life is out of control. If I had a job, we could get a mortgage. If I had a job, we'd have insurance so we can have a baby. If I had a job, we'd know what freaking neighborhood to live in. If I just had a job!!!
Negative net worth just blogged this. I thought it was a neat post, but now it's all I can think about.
My body is betraying everything. It's taking away our choices. Because of my stupid childhood asthma, we can't get a reasonable health plan. Because of my ticking clock, our hand might be forced. We finally have the money under control, and my body is taking away choices. We can't have a baby without real health insurance!! We can't have insurance with my crap body!!!
In high school, I used to play this game with my girlfriends. Money, love, career, kids. Pick three. If only we realized what we were doing. It was so very true. You can have all four, just not at the same time, I guess.
Monday, August 3, 2009
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32 comments:
You need some perspective. Yes, statistically, it gets harder to have a baby on your own after age 35.
But lots of people under 35 have a hard time and lots of people over don't have a hard time.
Frankly if I were you I would have slapped my dr. But that just me : )
There is never a good time to have a baby is a true sentiment - there is always something more you want first, something different to happen first so on so forth. It all boils down to what you are comfortable giving up - both in your life now and what you hoped for the future. I'm not saying you can't have dreams and goals - but babies change them often - sometimes completely, sometimes just modifying.
You dont have job health ins now - but once you have a child, there's no guarentee you keep that job and that ins either.
What I'm trying to say is if this is something you really want you need to think about your absolutes, not your wannas. For example - corporate sponsored health insurance might be an imperative for you. But maybe private school education is just a wanna.
There's very few things that a child truely needs - the biggest is a loving family. Everything else is stuff - some nice, some that cushion against risk, but still stuff.
You will figure out what is best for you.
Your BODY is betraying you, or your DOCTOR is betraying you? Frankly, he seems markedly behind the times. It's not like you're over 40, when the biological clock really is going crazy. Doctors, as a whole, are not the most politically progressive people--I wonder if he just doesn't prefer women to become mothers in their twenties, and that colors his responses to you. Do you have specific gynecological concerns that make it likely YOU will have difficulty with conception? If not, I'd take what he says about timing with a grain of salt. BTW, my mother gave birth to me, her first child, in 1949 at age 36. Ten months later (believe it or not, both births were planned!), at age 37, she had my sister.
Welcome to life... sucks doesn't it? but are you going to wait for Fair to happen or continue to complain?
HS
I had my first child at 33. I got pregnant very easily. I had my second child 21 months later. I had no problems. I am also high achieving, work in a professional, male dominant industry, and travel for my job. My children nor my husband have suffered b/c I waited to have children. In fact, you tend to have more patience for dealing with the little tykes when you a of "advanced maternal age."
My wife is pregnant at 43 after like 6 miscarriages trying to get pregnant since she was 39, so I definitely know first hand the ticking time clock. Hopefully this one will last, if only because its such a fervent hope of my wife's.
I guess I would say, yes there is a clock, though it seems pretty stupid of this doc of yours to say that at 27, you need to start worrying. I think if you are in good shape, you probably shouldn't need to worry until you are 35, so you have like 6-7 years before you should start worrying.
One thing I think often gets overlooked too. Having kids is not the be-all end-all. I think sometimes there is such an expectation put on people by their family, culture, religion, etc. to have kids, that enough people ask themselves whether that's what they truly want, whether that will make them happy. At least one study I've seen shows that people without kids are happier than those with kids.
The take-a-way: no need to rush things now, figure out what you want, when you want, you have some time.
Just because some women become pregnant after age 30 doesn't change the biological fact that a woman's fertility does decrease after the age of 30. I wouldn't suggest having a child (whether biologically or through adoption) unless you really want to and are ready to (whatever that means to you). If you want to become pregnant, the one advantage starting younger is that if you do have infertility issues you will have more time to have treatments that might work for you.
I loved having younger parents. They're now in their late 70s, but won't live forever. As the second oldest of four, I will have had more time with them than my younger siblings. Delaying starting a family until you're much older just means that you will have less time with them in your life and vice versa. As we age, most of us realize that none of the material success and the stuff we acquire in life really matter. It's only the people we love and spending as much time as possible with them that matters.
BTW, I had really crummy experiences with some male doctors. If you feel you're not getting the empathy or understanding you want from your current gyno, why don't you get some referrals from your friends for a new doctor.
I think you're doctor is being just a little bit dramatic with the whole "ticking clock" business. Yeah, sure, it's easier before 35, or even 30, but under no circumstances do you need to have a baby now. You have a choice. You can wait at least another 5 years.
I am 31 and I am finally at the point where I think I need to start thinking about children in the next 1-2 years. You're a good 4 years younger than me - there is no rush Dog, you have time.
Your Doc may be someone you have looked up to n your life, however, that does not mean he is "right" about everything.
Definitely change doctors. That comment was out of line.
As for Barb1954's comment about having "less time" with your kids if you delay pregnancy...First, we're talking only six to eight years, right? Second, you can never predict how long you will be in your children's lives. My father had his mother longer than I had mine -- my mom died six years ago, when I was almost 46, and my dad's mom died when he was 70.
And yeah, start trying to get pregnant when YOU want it. There is so much pressure to procreate that some people don't really think it through. My daughter got married last year and the first thing people asked when they heard was, "And when are you going to get to be a grandmother?" This despite the fact that my daughter has a chronic illness and her husband is currently unemployed -- this is a good situation to rush into pregnancy?!?
That said, if and when you and your sweetie decide to pass on your genes, make this deal with him: You'll take care of in-go and he'll take care of out-go. ;-)
My mom had my sister when she was 36 - no complications whatsoever. If now is really not the right time to have a baby, then it's not the right time. The right time will come and you'll make it work (maybe that means adopting, surrogate, what have you).
There's no way I'm having a child before I'm 30 (32, 33 seems ideal to me, IF I'm having a child at all). I have a long way to go in my career and a child is not getting in the way of that.
omg. I am so glad for the comments here. I want to reiterate what other ppl have said.
Get some perspective.
You have been complaining about the health care system and providers in america for some time now, yet yr going to get all emotional by what some doctor has said...
You have a partner and you are young young young. I'm 32 and single and I'm waiting happily for my life partner to come along - but life throws curve balls at you and life HAPPENS while you're busy waiting and wishing things away.
Get a grip. You are healthy and lovely and in a loving relationship and the world is yr oyster.
Live like that.
I think this subject is very difficult for gynecologists to address with 20-something women - it's a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation. I've read interviews with doctors where they say don't mention fertility unless the patient asks because they don't want to get called a neanderthal or a pessimist for telling young women to be aware of their fertility, and then by the time the patient mentions it, there are already problems. (paraphrased, I'll try and find some links when I get a chance)
Your doctor is telling you to be aware, to consider it and factor it into your plans. Many women don't realize that fertility takes a marked dive at age 35 - on average. There are women above the average and women below. Further clouding the picture is that many higher maternal age moms have needed ART and simply don't discuss it.
It's not fair, is it? I wish I had something to offer other than support - but sadly, we're in the same boat! And thanks for the link - I'm so flattered!
Huh. My mom was just shy of 44 when she gave birth to me, and that was in 1969. I think if I were in your shoes, I'd get a second opinion before you make any binding decisions.
I'm infertile. I was diagnosed with infertility at age 28 and it took me 4 years, much heartache, and IVF to become a mother to my twin daughters. And I would be the first to tell you that you should try to become a parent when you and your husband are ready to do so. Most people begin trying too soon in terms of emotional preparation and certainly in terms of financial readiness. It doesn't sound as though your doctor even bothered to listen to you. Stick with your original plan; it's a good one.
i think people are getting a little bit defensive.
1. i agree with barb. Exceptions do not refute biology. The fact that something becomes harder after a certain age does not mean it is impossible or that everyone will struggle. In the same way that younger women are more fertile does not mean every young woman will have it easy conceiving.
2. Her doctor did not say she should start worrying. He said she should start thinking about it. I really don't see why that's cause to go look for a new doctor. I think about kids now but I know I'm not financially ready.
3. It also depends on how many kids you want to have and if you mind being an "old" parent. if you want 4 kids and start at 35, you might be in for some rough time.
More nasty anonymouses...
Ditto what Barb says about statistics. Vivid anecdotes do not make for great generalizations, and vivid anecdotes abound.
Having kids later may be easy for you -- but the biological fact is that it will be easier for you to have them earlier than later. whew, too many relativisms there!
27 isn't too old to have a baby -- but you should start planning for one since it's on your agenda. Wasn't that your doctor's message?
It's easy to feel overwhelmed, esp when at a time when you don't have access to that easy (illusion of) identity and life structure that a job provides for a person.
You can't get good health insurance because the US of A insurance market is a monopolistic mess, not because you had the nerve to suffer from asthma. Move to Canada or Europe. If Senor Dog's business is truly B2B, surely that's possible! :) LOL
Anyways, one thing at a time, dog. What else can you do?
PS: the best temporary cure I know of for the baby itch is to babysit for a creaming toddler ~shudder~.
Dog I realize you're stressing and it's something I have thought about too...being 29 and not yet married. But from reading your blog the past year I thought your plan was always adoption so why the freak out about the so-called biological clock?
I agree with most of the commenters - your doctor doesn't sound all that tactful. If you're not comfortable with him, switch!
But - this is what I've read (note, totally not a medical professional here, and please correct me if I've got my facts mixed up): a woman's fertility peaks at around 22 and steadily but slowly declines until she's around 35, which is when the decline becomes markedly steeper. I'm past 22, so while I don't hear a clock ticking (and I don't think I will for a while), if I am an "average female", my fertility is declining.
I don't think you should have cause for alarm, because chances are you are perfectly fine. But if you're concerned, after you find a job it might be a good idea to get a fertility test (again, not a medical professional means I don't even know if there's such a thing as a fertility test) just to put your mind at ease.
I do agree that the most important thing is to be emotionally and financially ready for a baby before you have one, but if you are certain you want to have a biological kid with your partner, then the doctor's right, there's a finite amount of time when that can happen (NOT to say that you should rush).
This comment is super long, so my apologies. This whole issue of body / clock / fertility kind of confuses me. On the one hand, I know there's the science, on the other hand, there's the personal...
I wish you the best!
I was going to make a comment along the lines of Donna Freedman's - that life is not a "numbers game" and I am tired of hearing people put things as serious as family structure down to neat little attempted calculations. I find that to be absurd.
Think about this: Women in my family (who were not unlike their contemporaries, from what I have seen) in generations past like my great grandmother, great-great grandmother, etc. had a baby every other year or so until approximately age 46. I believe this meant they utilized their entire reproductive lifespan and I don't believe that there's much different in this process (given good health) in 20s, 30s, or 40s (I can attest to that, actually, for the 20s and 30s, anyway.) (now, granted, I will concede that the "works" may work better when used early and continuously than when initiated late, but I certainly don't know this to be fact. It could be a false theory of mine.)
Sorry, Barb, but that's such a "1954-born female" thing to say about how it must be the uncool male doctor. (I've known women of your approximate age and it's a typical bad-male-doctor comment.) I don't know how serious the doctor was being, but I'm guessing he was just saying, "Anytime now!" (Maybe by "couple years" he meant 5 years?) Tell him the time is not now, if it's not, and if he really makes an issue, (now that I think of it, I've never had a doctor comment on a personal life choice like that) then yeah, go with someone you like better, but I don't think it's a "male" issue (I've been to all sorts of OB/GYNs and I've seen no pattern - except in the other direction in my relatively small sample - males being the exceptional sweethearts, actually.)
If you're open to adoption, then there should be no rush. But if you're set on having your own biological children, then it's important to consider when you're going to have your child. For some people, it's not easy to get pregnant. Having a child is a big decision. While it's great to live your life, there is no guarantee that you'll be able to have your own biological children when you're older.
As for me, I would love to wait to make partner at my firm before having kids. Without kids and the willingness to work hard, I think I could do it about 7-10 years. But the reality is that I want 3 kids (ideally). I want to have all of my kids before age 35, eek this is scaring me since I'm already 29. Not only does getting pregnant become harder after 35, the risk of birth defects also increases drastically (family history). So my husband and I trying now. We just started. We wanted to start earlier, but the time wasn't right.
I agree with most other posters. I'm slightly older than you and am not even married yet. There is still time. You should want it to be the right time for you and your Senor Dog, not you and your doctor.
Even though you've been going to your doctor your whole life, I can't help but think this healthcare crisis is effecting him and his profits. Similar to the auto mechanic who always finds something wrong with your car, could he be coaxing you to get pregnant already so he can make more money from visits?
I waited until age 35 to start our family. As we struggled with unexpected male factor infertility issues, my eggs continued to age. Approximately 60 thousand dollars later, we have one child.
I learned a lot while hanging out in the Reproductive Endocrinologist office. According to the nurses, most over 40 celebrity moms got pregnant using donor eggs. That's another difficult decision...and extremely expensive. My current advice, all other things being equal, is ideally a woman should start her family by age 30 and be content with the size of her family by age 35.
If you want factual information about fertility and a woman's age, call the national headquarters of Resolve. Their web site is resolve.org
Don't be scared by one doctor or mislead into a false sense of security, like I was, by late age celebrity success stories.
Get the facts and then you can make the right decision for you and your husband.
To 444, I was writing from personal experience. Don't generalize about us feminist babyboomers. If we have anything in common, it might be that when I was in my 20s and 30s in the '70s and '80s, there were more male than female doctors. The men I was referring to were in their 50s or older at the time and had a very Marcus Welby-type attitude (TV doctor played by the same actor who starred on "Father Knows Best"), very patronizing who basically patted me on the head and basically said not to worry about anything when I brought legitimate concerns to their attention.
For the record, I think there are great and lousy doctors of both genders. My internist is a woman but my gynocologist is a man. (He specializes in gyn oncology but that's another story.) They're both fantastic and for years have been voted as among the best doctors in the city by other doctors and nurses. The fertility specialist I saw was also a man and on the "best of" list.
As I suggested to Dog, if she doesn't like her current doctor for whatever reason, she should find one she likes better.
"in their 50s or older at the time and had a very Marcus Welby-type attitude (TV doctor played by the same actor who starred on "Father Knows Best"), very patronizing who basically patted me on the head and basically said not to worry about anything when I brought legitimate concerns to their attention."
My doctor is just like that and I love love LOVE him. That's because I go in worried and go out walking on a cloud. I guess I don't think that just because he is reassuring and tells me not to worry about things I don't need to worry about, that he is patronizing me. I believe he is extremely experienced in his field and I appreciate his kind manner as well as his medical expertise. If I had a chip on my shoulder I guess I'd suspect he was up to something because he didn't want to braid my hair and snack on some granola with me and talk about negative and positive chakra or something. :oD
Oh, BTW, while my doctor literally does pat me (on the back, I'm too tall to pat on the head) and "That Is Normal" is 90% of what he ever says to me, he's Egyptian, so I guess that partially excuses him from the Marcus Welby stereotype. In the hippie/feminist world, most likely being of significantly foreign extraction makes him "cool."
I know how you feel, Dog. I just turned 33 and I'm definitely getting worried about when and if I'll be able to have kids. I'm not married yet even (although I do have a long-term BF). It's true that age is not the only factor but I don't think your doctor was out of line for bringing up the subject. At 27, though, assuming that you or Senor Dog don't have other infertility issues, I wouldn't be quite as freaked out as you are. As most others have noted, the closer you get to 35 (ahem), the more you should worry/seriously think about time. On the other hand, I know personally of several women who had children after age 35 with no problems. I do think they are more than likely the exception rather than the rule. You just never know what will happen to you at any age, though. Life does have a way of going the opposite direction of what you imagined!
Your doctor sounds like an ass. I refuse to even think about having kids until I'm in my late thirties. Yes, it will be statistically harder to get pregnant, but not impossible. And on the off chance it is? Oh well. I'm not sure I'd mind.
444, in what world is being a feminist synonymous with being a hippie? If it wasn't for the activism of feminists, young women today would not have the education, career, and athletic opportunities that are now available to them and which they've come to take for granted. BTW, no one who knows me would ever have characterized me as a hippie. You really should stop stereotyping people.
My point, since it obviously wasn't clear, is that no one knows your body better than you. What's "normal" for other women may not be normal for you. I want a physician who respects me as a partner and participant in my own healthcare. Dog's physician might have great medical knowledge, but if she doesn't care for the way he communicates with her, the time he gives in answering her questions, the way his office staff treats her, or whatever reason, she should find someone she does like.
Your doctor is a Moron. I've had multiple conversations with doctors, and fertility doesn't fall off a cliff at 30. Even at 35, it's not a you can't get pregnant.
Geez. You're 27 and just got married this year. Give it time to settle. What's the rush?
Trust me it'll happen easier than you anticipate.
Another infertile posting here (now mothering one child conceived on IVF #4). Yes, fertility declines with age. Yes, it starts early. Yes, the risk of a wide assortment of chromosomal disorders, as well as various health problems associated with pregnancy, rise with maternal age.
Maybe you'll have problems conceiving; maybe you'll wish you'd started trying earlier. But in the absence of a reason (beyond general worry) to think so, your chances of not having problems are actually pretty good.
If you're not on the pill and want to do something cheap, you could buy (readily available used) the book Taking Charge of Your Fertility which offers a ton of information about low-cost ways to track your own cycle (only useful if your unmedicated cycle is in place, so not if you're taking the pill or relying on other hormonal birth control). If you turn up signs of problems (e.g. you don't appear to be ovulating predictably) or if you already suspect problems, like if you have irregular cycles, then, yes, maybe this should become a priority. But honestly without more reason to advise panic, and even knowing what I do about infertility treatment, I don't think panic is warranted. Honestly.
(And I'm not meaning to sound flip by writing about "panicking," it's just comment shorthand -- sorry if it offends)
Dog, I'm ready to kick your doctor in the ding-ding.
I'm 36, and my doctor has been telling me the same thing since I was 29: If you're going to have a baby, do it by 35. My sweetie & I weren't planning for kids, so I ignored it. I found it frustrating, but brushed it off.
This year, we decided that we are financially/emotionally "ready" and want kids. When I talked to my GP, he tried to discourage me and suggested I talk to sweetie about booking a vasectomy because it's an easier procedure for the man than for the woman.
Honestly, I was too stunned to respond. Then I went home and got mad. I mean, furious. The irony? He's in his early 40s. So this is what they're teaching doctors?
Don't stress. Get educated. Decide if you want to adopt, then act accordingly. And get a new GP. I am. If you are uncomfortable with your doctor for Any reason, you should change. He or she is an authority figure.
I understand that some people (apparently the relatives of all your readers) are capable of bearing a healthy child throughout their 30's and even into their 40's, but no one can argue that that is the normal. Honestly, if your Dr told you to wait and did not warn you about this issue, he would be an irresponsible man.
I am 22 and due to a giant medical emergency that almost killed me, I have severely reduced fertility. My Dr has told me that if I want the chance to ever have children, I need to start trying at age 25-27. I will start trying then, even though I'll be in the middle of a prestigious grad program at an Ivy League university, because my health and wellbeing is not worth a few more years of perfect planning.
After going through this emergency (which was pregnancy related), I have discovered that when you think about this issue, don't just think about the effect it will have on your life, but you need to think about the effect it will have on your body. If an older woman had gone through this issue (say 35), it is very possible that she would have died because her body would not have been able to recover from the strain. That fact made me realize that as there are so many things that can happen during pregnancy, I need to go into the pregnancy with the best chances of bearing a healthy child as possible.
On the other hand, I have been with my partner for 5+ years, and we are very committed. Like most people, we were planning to wait to have children until our late 20's - early 30's. The experience of almost losing me made him change all of his perspectives about wanting to wait to have children!
So what I am saying is you have to balance the health risks of your actions. The risk of waiting: infertility, miscarriages (higher rate), much higher rate of pregnancy complications, more difficult birth (higher rates of almost all birth-related problems for mother), much higher rate of complications and chronic health issues for the baby (like mental disabilities, etc.).
Regardless of whether or not some women had kids up until 46 or some had their first baby at 39... you just do not know how YOUR body is going to react
For me, I feel as though it makes perfect sense that women can still have kids up until the age of 45, but do you really want to?
I would rather have kids when I am younger, more fit, healthier and able to weather any kind of problem rather than stressing through it at the age of 45 for the first time...
With that being said, you still have plenty of time, but sometimes old advice is the best -- kids before 35 is the rule I am sticking too
Personally, for MY body, I just do not want any further complications than necessary just because I wanted to wait for my career, etc. And the younger I am, the better the chance I have of making it through any possible problem.
Set your own priorities and follow them through. Do not have a baby just because of a ticking time clock, wait until YOU feel it is right rather than what a Dr. says.
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